Chick-fil-A has long been known as a Christian organization. The fact that they are not open on Sundays is the most obvious sign that the company is willing to put their faith before profit. The pathetic calls for boycotts of the well-loved sandwich store or the wacky protests that have been reported widely around the country (typically only a handful of loudmouth activists are present, despite the media blitz) should be completely disregarded as the call of the loons.
Upon learning of the restaurant owner's stance on traditional marriage, a defiant Mayor Thomas M. Menino stated "Chick-fil-A doesn't belong in Boston." He backtracked a bit on his statements after he was criticized in the press. Another example of a position "evolving"?
Americans are being encouraged by some intolerant wackos to boycott a restaurant for having President Obama's view (before his position "evolved") that marriage is between a man and a woman. Fine. If an individual is so incensed over this issue, he or she can forgo the waffle fries.
But is it not intolerance to protest someone's religious beliefs? Is it not going against First Amendment Rights to shut down the conversation by shouting over the opposing side?
As stated in Boston.com, "But which part of the First Amendment does Menino not understand? A business owner's political or religious beliefs should not be a test for the worthiness of his or her application for a business license."
A New Movement: Put Your Money Where Your Heart Is
Perhaps Americans should start to consider their own values when making purchases. Glenn Beck and his company have invented a website that promotes highly vetted small businesses with great products and has free-market values. Perhaps people should start to consider values before making purchases, while also helping American small businesses.
If it is morally acceptable to encourage a boycott of the fast food chain due to the religious beliefs of their owners, then it must certainly be morally justifiable to boycott the music industry, Hollywood, and other companies that support beliefs not compatible to one's own. There are lists of companies traditional marriage or are openly pro-abortion all over the internet.
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Comments: 195
I dare you to put and leave up a post defending religious people who are being picked on for denying women full equal rights. As many muslims do today, and christians used to do en masse in this country.
And another post defending christians who believe Africans should still be enslaved. And if you can't find any - post one defending the large mass of christians in The U.S.A. who used to believe that, and were 'abused' for it.
Those cognizant of history understand that gays are just one more group on a long, long religious hit list.
Obviously you believe I have some hidden evil conservative agenda here but I can assure you that I am an open book and I believe what I say But a defence of socially conservative values - such as denying full equal rights to gays. What right am I denying gays?
You forget (and most do these days) that Christians have rights, too. By the way, so should white men, conservatives, the elderly and unborn children.
I suggest that you reconsider your 'positions'...or, your Screen Name.
Passive-aggressive much, Renee?
Or are you just trying to gain fame for yourself by regularly sending out e-mails trumpeting your new posts - and making an outrageous body of statements, a la Ann Coulter?
Your current Gather profile lists you as a PhD student. So perhaps you are playing social conservatives here for a college study.
You know: instead of a la Ann Coulter - a la Ron Jones and The Third Wave.
Either way - you are entertaining.
I believe that there is a level of hypocrisy in promoting tolerance while bashing Christians. From the perspective of the Christians, who believe it is sacred (and I would not judge them on that) and from the perspective of a gay person, who seeks to not just have a "partner" but a "husband" or "wife" as the case may be (and of course I would not judge them on that).
I do, however, believe that people jump to judgement way too quickly. Maybe we can work together instead of allowing the media to get us all worked up, which is exactly what they are doing.
If you want to discriminate against an entire class of people and outlaw their relationships and their unions - that is not fine. That is bigoted. That is discrimination.
If you choose to use your religion to justify your bigotry, that is also not fine, and you can expect your religion to receive the same backlash against that bigotry and hatred. It is fair game when you try to legislate your morality into secular society.
Give up the persecution complex and start getting used to being attacked for being a bigot, because that is what good people do when they are presented with horrible people."
-reader George Blackburn, 06:40 PM 27 July, 2012 under CNN Money article on Jeff Bezos & wife donating to uphold WA State marriage equality law
We are ALL, every one of us, treated equally under the Law.
You may Marry anyone you wish of the opposite Sex...I may Marry anyone I wish, of the opposite Sex. Though you cannot "marry" another of the same Sex, neither can I "marry" another, of the same Sex. The Law applies equally to ALL!
There, you see? Spelled out like a lizard drinkin'!
Therefore, there is no "discrimination." None.
Simple!
If you are suggesting that gov't no longer acknowledge marriages, but only civil unions for straight & gay - and leave marriage to religion/holy book followers - then you seem to make a fair point.
But are you being disingenuous in your point here?
Considering that Chick-Fil-A and/or its owner(s) are said to have donated to organizations than not only want to deny marriage to gays, but also deny us equal civil unions, that rally against anti-bullying measures, and that advocate for lethal termination of gays?
I acknowledge that your position just above is technically correct. But you are incorrect in the larger point:
The law has been and often continues to be written so that everyone who is not precluded from equality is treated equally under the law.
As religious people do and have very widely denied to
African slaves,
women,
Jews,
christians imprisoned in Saudi Arabia for merely wanting to build a church,
"the heathen Chinee" in The U.S.A.,
"godless redskin savages" exterminated or herded onto reservations,
burning witches and heretics alive,
etc.
Your holy book advocacy is largely indefensible based just on its strong association with long-term, hyper-massive human rights violations against many many groups.
To which organizations did they donate? I would have to look at that.
I am starting to think that I need to seriously start looking at organizations myself - for example, I am pro-life - why would I give my money to organizations that support abortion, for example?
There is not a ONE precluded from equality under the Law. Please; present to me ONE scenario regarding Marriage and homosexuality wherein there is a Law that does not apply to me, that applies to you.
Just one.
Say Yes! To Bullying Gays In Schools
"The Southern Poverty Law Center???" One of the most pathetic and disgusting Leftist Organisations on the Planet??? By God...
The Truth is, these perversions have a profoundly negative effect on our Society; and those who intend to undermine it have nothing in their "thinking" and in their demands but to feed their own misguided narcissism.
That even one single American has swallowed the P.C. B.S. that is known as the "hate crime" is an indication of just how successful the indoctrination camps have been. There is no "love" lost with the one who commits ANY Crime.
hyper "intellect," indeed...
To answer your question, Chick-Fil-A owners have contributed to the Family Research Council, so there are mutual values against numerous aspects of gay rights.
Your post here has provided a lot of different viewpoints for consumption - wonderful!
NO, Renee...it isn't.
I'm waiting...
One.
Your slip is showing. (Grin.)
And here I thought you said you were one of the best cookers of chickens.
You don't destroy a Society for the sake of a miniscule narcissistic percentage who choose to act-out their anti-Social behaviours.
I'm still waiting for that example...
No example will please that very large portion of the holy book community that has historically discriminated against
group after
group after
group after
group after
group after
group after
group.
And then when such groups say they want their rights, holy book followers say such groups are bullying them, are insecure, are throwing tantrums, are intolerant, ad nauseum. Such people are beyond the pale and beyond the ability to reason.
Although you requested my response here, if you are insecure or feel the need to continue bullying your victims while pretending holy book believers are the victims, then I will be glad to let you have the last word in this thread.
You are extremely confused.
"Thou Shalt Not Kill" is referring to not kiling people not animals.
Why would God command the Israelites to offer animal sacrifice and allow the priests to eat of the sacrifices?
I could also quote scripture of Christ and the use of fish as food.
Like I said it baffles me how anyone could come to the conclusion that Jesus was a vegan.
Why would God command the Israelites to offer animal sacrifice and allow the priests to eat of the sacrifices? good point.
Nancy, Just as my business I do not promote my beliefs nor put them on anyone. I wish we all could be as understanding. Nothing wrong with a little debate, if people are willing, but to mock or to try to shut down someone else's views is an entirely different story.
That is an English translation. In the Hebrew original the Lord commands man to be a "con-server" {'to serve with'}
I'm certain that that will be duly noted...and that God thanks you for His meaning...
Tell me that next time a mosquito bites you.
humans do not need flesh nor are designed to do so. as man evolved they digestive systems changes, our hands changed as did our mouths and teeth. to each his own. I choose not to consume blood and death and i am incredibly healthy...and perhaps i also choose not to intake chemical pills. I am fortunate to live an organic life. My god is nature and her natural ways. I respect all your religions, and perhaps if all had respect others we might not be in this mess.
Biblical Truth is Spiritually-discerned.
"Interpretation" has nothing to do with it.
Obviously. Hence, the confusion.
You are quite right!
Conversely, however, please consider the following:
One OTHER thing I think we might be prudent about is the FAILURE to hold to account those for the beliefs that they, as a Group DO hold. A group should, of course, never be condemned for the actions of a few; but, what is rightousness, is holding the entire Group accountable for what that Group STANDS for!
For example; if the Leftist movement stands for the bigotry they hold against, say, Conservative Black Women (or Wise White Girls with nice Smiles ;), and one chooses to call themselves a Leftist, then they will have to account for what Leftists stand for. Yes?
Let us try this another way:
I could no more call myself a "republican" than I could a bubbler...because the "republican" is a statist, Big-Government Group, as a whole.
I couldn't possibly want to be caught in support of what that Group believes...and therefore, in favour of Truth, I cannot count myself in that Group. I cannot, in Truth and Conscience, be counted as a "republican."
Yes?
"Fabulous!!!!!!!" Wonderful, then!
Yes!...yes you ARE!
Poor Jesus. Everyone tries to put meat or fish into the Lord’s mouth. He’s a pure vegetarian. He came from Essenes tradition and the Essenes are vegetarian all the time. clearly in the Bible it’s stated in many places, that humans should not eat meat at all. “Be thou not among flesh eaters and wine drinkers.” “Meat for the belly, belly for the meat and God will destroy both meat and them.”
“Who told you to kill all the bullocks and the she-sheep to make offer for me? Please stop the killing of all these innocents. Wash your hands because they are full of blood. If you continue to do that, I will turn my head away when you pray.” And there is a translated book from Aramaic, by Edmund Bordeaux Szekely, he’s Hungarian. From the old text books which were found in the Vatican archive, believed to be the teachings of Jesus. In that, Jesus instructed that his disciples should not eat animal flesh at all.
If the Lord were to eat fish, why would he tell his first 12 disciples to forsake fishing and follow him to fish men instead? (Yes.)
A compassionate Master like Jesus, who would carry a stranger’s weak, injured lamb up the hill so the lamb would not be beaten up or kicked by the shepherd or dragged by the shepherd, how would he eat any living creature?
"The "wisdom" of the "Wise" He will frustrate."
Many different groups claim the title "Christian" and yet hold widely--or wildly--diverse opinions about what beliefs are "Christian". Holding one group--or denomination--accountable as "Christians" will provoke a huge outcry from other "Christians" who hold different beliefs.
I believe in finding common ground; not drawing further lines to separate us even more than we already are. "A house divided against itself cannot stand" is a quote much older than Abraham Lincoln.
Many different groups claim the title "Christian" and yet hold widely--or wildly--diverse opinions about what beliefs are "Christian". Holding one group--or denomination--accountable as "Christians" will provoke a huge outcry from other "Christians" who hold different beliefs.
Romans 14:6 He who regards one day as special, does so to the Lord. He who eats meat, eats to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who abstains, does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God.
The big picture here is that this mayor had no right not allowing this establishment into its community... We have one in this town and they are the first ones on the scene with free food in many a disaster that we may have, even when a bad car wreck is on the road. This company has been known to do all kinds of good for the schools and are an asset to our community...
It is bigots such as this mayor and those on think like him... Is this mayor that insecure that they let one person state their belief about gay marriage and right away this mayor is denying his community a decent place... I think this mayor should be boycotted and asked to resign... If anyone is bigot it is a mayor who is trying to silence anothers freedom of speech...and a community of a great place who helps people..
Move on Chic Fil A to another location and generate money for another worthy community because wherever this mayor is at, its obvious that he puts his own bigot thinking above the best interest of this town...
Tolerance must include acceptance of divergent viewpoints. I dont understand the rage that is expressed on the gay marriage issue. (Please dont bother to explain it, I have seen all the explanations about equal rights and so on, and I am in agreement. What I dont understand is the rage, not the argument).
It is also a good idea to stop characterizing social and political opinions as Christian. Christians can be found on both sides of many issues, including gay marriage, evolution, immigration, and so on. Some Christians, and many anti Christians, love to point to a view expressed by a Christian and say - "Christians think that...." What Christians think is that Jesus Christ, son of the living God, is our savior and redeemer from sin. The rest is commentary.
That there are "christians" who would call themselves so, on either side of any issue, does not make them Christians, save for convenience.
Moral Relativism can be applied anywhere one wishes...but does not make anything "so"...
If, for example, a rabid disciple of 'animal rights' claims to be a Christian, we know that this would be complete nonsense. The Lord despises foolishness; therefore, the equating of taking a Human Life with that of taking the Life of an Animal is profoundly disgusting, and foolishness to Him. He has given Man dominion.
Conversely, the homosexual is not despised by the Lord; that one would claim to be a Christian would not be detestable to HIM; however, engaging in detestable Acts would. And, he would no more be a Christian than one who detests the Christ.
The Lord said, "Thou shalt not Murder." I might think about Murdering, and that is not detestable to HIM; for He knows that I am Sinful, and Fallen. That I would perpetrate Murder...now there, for those with Ears to Hear...is DETESTABLE. To HIM.
That one would think of something Sinful, or do something Sinful, are not one-in-the-same. He is quite capable of understanding "degree;" He is, after all...its Creator ;)
It is not that Christians "believe" that homosexuality is "wrong;" It is that the Lord says it's wrong. THAT is what makes it wrong! However...
He knows of our Fallen Nature, and Loves; and we Live, Blissfully...
...in a State of Grace. :)
You correctly note that religious people are on multiple sides of the gay rights issue.
But you fail to note that in The U.S.A., this is a largely recent phenomenon. In our recent past christians were against gay rights by an enormous margin. And in many other countries, this is still the case from both christians & muslims.
Homophobia comes from somewhere. The source is largely holy book believers and those conditioned by them - and far less from agnostics and atheists.
Hopefully you accidentally forgot to mention these, rather than passively trying to mislead people.
I agree about impoliteness by both the right and the left I witness frequently on many issues.
On Gather recently I've seen a lefty use the term assholian against others, and a righty label others leftards. I called my friend on the a word, but did not accost the individual using the l word.
No, Sir; I correctly noted that the confused, who call themselves christians, are on both sides of the Issue.
Simon; homosexuals have every last right that you or I do. The Law applies equally, and perfectly.
My interpretation and beliefs is that Thou shalt not kill, means, thou shalt no kill
"God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."
"Dominion over the Earth" means precisely what He'd intended for it to mean.
"Perception" and "interpretation" have nothing to do with Truth...and are the excuse and the bailiwick of the confused.
Truth is Spiritually-Discerned.
*Crickets*
Awesome!
By the you-know-what...what was it you were reading?
"Small Minded and Bigoted Chikin Enthusiasts!!!"
*..buk-buk-buk...!!!*
Everyone has a right to their opinion.
It might be equally-possible that she follows marching-orders rather willingly.
"Marching orders?" ha ha ha ha ha ha .. I can't wait until my husband comes home and I can repeat this to him. He says he's allowed to make the decisions in our household and he has my permission to say that. :) ha ha ha ha
My husband says I have an "I ain't gotta gene" which is common in my ancestry... he'd attest to the fact nobody gives me orders. He knows better than to give me orders.. because he knows I will dig my heels in. We may be married 32 years but giving me orders still ain't happening...
You can be wrong on the rest.
Oh well... back to agreement on one.
Carry on with your wrongness :)
The photo was in my Dad's wallet until he passed away in 2005. I never even knew he was carrying it around...
Mark-John, I have no idea. It's too late now to ask. I was very touched though when I found it in his wallet. See I have 4 adult children, and it would be hard to squeeze them all in the same photo. Sometimes I do put up my wedding photo.. Which I'll go switch to now. Just for you so you can see what I looked like 20 years after this photo.
Sometimes, a Man must adore his Little One in just the way that He does.
Now, would you please put back the photo of the little nose-miner?! :)
Yours (of the ankle-biting variety) is just such an Avatar. Very easy to identify.
It's really rather pleasant, as well.
What a little Doll...!
If you read the Baptist Press article that this whole "fuss" is about you will see that Dan Cathy does not consider Chick-fil-a a "Christian" company. He does a good job of explaining why.
http://www.bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?id=38271
I didn't realize it, but apparently there are a lot of people in the media reading the Baptist Press. They act suprised that a Christian business owner being interviewed by Christian media would have the gall to admit he supports Biblical marriage. The article does not even mention anything about homosexuals or "gay marriage". Yet, the pro-homosexuals feel so threatened by the promotion of Biblical marriage that they feel they must demonize the CEO of a small fast food restaurant who happens to believe different than they do. Do they really want tolerance? I don't think so. They want to silence any speech that may even remotely puts homosexuality in a bad light. As we can see from the reaction of these mayors it has now become politically expedient to bash those who support Biblical marriage.
As we can see from the reaction of these mayors it has now become politically expedient to bash those who support Biblical marriage. This is a great statement.
off for the afternoon, have a glorious peaceful day
You are quite confused, nonetheless. It is Secularism that is responsible for more Death and Misery on this Planet than any other. It dwarfs "religion" as a cause for War a thousand-fold.
Renee is quite right.
In how many wars over the last 1,000 years did both sides believe God was on their side?
Mao.....................62 Million
Lenin and Stalin....100+ Million (very conservatively)
Pot......................1.7 Million
Il Sung.................1.6 Million
Hitler....................16 Million
...ad infinitum.
There are many, many more....
Mao.....................62 Million
Lenin and Stalin....100+ Million (very conservatively)
Pot......................1.7 Million
Il Sung.................1.6 Million
Hitler....................16 Million
...ad infinitum
Boob, up there, is under the ridiculous and ignorant impression that "religion" causes all of the War and Death on this Planet. I've, of course, assisted him in his egregious error...along with the kind assistance of a Doll named Renee. :)
"History is full of uncounted massacres by armies carrying a religious banner, though most such episodes were in ancient times with much less efficient killing technology and microscopically smaller populations. The number of religious exterminations of entire villages throughout history is innumerable, though most had body counts only in the hundreds or thousands. Alexander the Great is estimated to have executed a million. 11th century Crusades killed half a million Jews and Muslims. Genghis Khan's massacres of entire populations of cities probably totaled a million. The Aztecs once slaughtered 100,000 prisoners over four days. An unknown number, probably in the millions, died in the Devil's Wind action in Colonial India. Up to four million Hindus, Sikhs, and Muslims died in post-Colonial India. The Ottoman Empire massacred two million Armenians over the years. Franco's Spanish Civil War killed a hundred thousand. A million have died in Rwanda, half a million in Darfur. And Christian vs. Muslim violence has obviously dominated our headlines for a decade, totaling somewhere in seven figures.
"So who has been the worst throughout history: atheist regimes or religious regimes? Obviously the big numbers come from the 20th century superpowers (China, Russia, Germany) so the answer depends on how you classify those. And this is where the meat of these debates is usually found, splitting hairs on which regime is atheist, which is merely secular, which is non-Christian and thus fair game to be called atheist. Hitchens points out that Stalin's government had all the trappings of religion, including Orwell's totalitarian theocracy, and thus it's merely a play on words to say that it was not religious. Pol Pot was raised a Buddhist monk who grew up to execute Buddhist monks, along with anyone else he could lay his hands on. Whole books have been written on the occult underpinnings of Nazi Germany, the symbology of the Norse gods, to say nothing of the claims that Hitler was a Christian, Hitler was a Jew, and his own writings expressing the kinship he felt with the Muslims. A favorite counterpoint raised by Christian debaters is that these despots practiced Social Darwinism and were thus atheists by definition. In summary, the winner of these debates is the one who can convince the other that the big 20th century genocidal maniacs were motivated either by religion or by a desire to destroy religion. The entire debate is the logical fallacy of the excluded middle."
http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4076
You now have the opportunity to teach a Leftist the Truth.
Yes; and the Murderers are Secularists, and staggeringly-so.
Go. Teach them.
I don't know why I would tell them that. I'll tell anyone who tries to play this childish numbers game that psychopathology is not inherent in any religion or lack of. I encourage you to do the same. You have an excellent opportunity to start with Mark here.
It is absolutely impossible for someone who does not actually share in my faith to understand, analyze, or describe my faith. That is not meant as an insult to anyone's thought process or intelligence. You could memorize the entire Bible, word for word, but unless you share the actual spiritual side of the faith, you are no closer to understanding the faith. You cannot learn my faith. You cannot explain my faith. You cannot analyze my faith. You must live my faith, or you cannot comprehend the very foundation of the faith, and what pushes us to place the very structure of our lives on that faith.
It is only natural that if you try to analyze every single religion, every single individual, and the good and the not so good with those individuals, and try to base the conclusion on collective thoughts that involve all of these components, you cannot help but be confused about any of the religions, or what each may represent. My faith is my personal relationship with God, and that is the foundation of my faith. That relationship is all that I have control over, and the rest of the world should not judge me, just as I do not judge the rest of the world based on my faith. Free will is alive and well, and based on my faith, that free will allows all to make their own choices and decisions, but it does not impact my personal faith. The acceptance of my faith by others does not, nor will ever alter, weaken, or create compromise as it relates to my faith.
It is absolutely impossible for someone who does not actually share in my faith to understand, analyze, or describe my faith.
I think the worst is when people mock and ridicule those with faith. Another example of non-tolerance.
They place their faith, hope and beliefs in themselves...and therefore, have nothing upon which to base their Values. That is why this Country is experiencing a Crisis of Values...
Would you care to start your own Post, and discuss?
It would seem as though I am, Renee!